04. 1984-1985 - THE BEGINNING OF GUNS N' ROSES

[...] in, you know, early summer 1984, Tracii hit me up to invest in his band, LA Guns, which was Pyrrhus, but Mike [Jagosz] had got fired and he [=Tracii] reformed the band... So I wasn't gonna do it but then I heard that Axl was available because I was, like, I asked him cuz I was leaving, like, "What's up with Hollywood Rose?" or whatever, and he goes, "They broke up," and Izzy was jamming with his band called London [...] so Tracii wanted me to invest in his band and, "I will think about it," you know. And then when I heard that Axl was available and I was like, "Man, maybe I can get Axl and Tracii together, man, that would be fucking huge." Tracii is a shredder, I mean, no matter what I think about him now, I mean, the guy could play guitar, I mean, I don't think there's any doubt about that. So it's like, "I'll think about it," and then if I went on a road trip with my brother, pick up my brother from Northern California, bring him back, and when I came back I said, "Oh yeah, Tracii, I'll invest in your band," and my whole reason was to try to get Axl to join LA Guns. [...] so Axl joins LA Guns, he eventually... like, Axl's telling me like four times, like, "No." I can't keep hitting him up and I just gave up. And then he just called me out of the blue one day and I guess he had gone home to Indiana and he decided that he was gonna give Tracii a shot. Tracii's good at snoozing [?] people so he had like talked Axl into it-

[...] [Axl] said he didn't think that Tracii and him were on the same page musically. [...] And then I remember Tracii's like, "Just offer him a pair of leather pants and he'll join." [...] I was like, "I don't want him in the band if that's what you fucking got to do." So when I told Axl that later, you know, I was like, "Hey," when he called and said he wanted to join, I was like, "Hey, dude," and I told him what Tracii said, Axl was like, "I wouldn't join the fucking band if you gave me a car and a house if I wasn't into it," and I'm like, "Okay, good, good to hear." And then, man, it was great. La Guns with Axl was great. Can you believe that?

So we did the live shows and then we're recording and Axl had laid down vocals for Heartbreak Hotel, because they covered that. [?] Elvis Presley tune. And he laid tracks down for that and then the producer guy was a dick, I mean I like him, but when it came to like interacting with Axl he was at dick. He would try to get Axl to stand still in the studio and don't move around and everything like that, so they had like a confrontation about that and then Axl left, and then I told the producer guy, it was like, "Look, Chuck, don't tell him what to do, just let him sing, let him sing his song, that's how it works. If he needs to dance around when he's singing, let him dance around." And then, yeah, we never made it back in the studio after that, the guys had finished the tracks, like the basic tracks, non vocals, and then Axl was supposed to come in but before then he quit.

And Axl at that point still thought I had the L.A. Guns tape of Heartbreak Hotel but we had recorded over his vocals after he left and everything, we just needed the tape back then. I think it was like $200 for a 2 inch tape or something like that and we needed to get Mike's songs on there. So we recorded over Axl. And then Mike Jagosz could not pull off the version of Heartbreak Hotel as it was arranged and recorded.

Yeah, I remember Rob got that blended together because Michael was the singer for Pyrrhus, you know, high school band, and it basically became LA Guns. So Mike was gone, yeah, so to Rob it's just like Tracii, Ole, Mike and them[?] were in a band and then Axl singing after that.

[...] Axl, Ole, Joe [Cue's brother], and me headed for the Rainbow. When we requested the big booth in the corner, Michael [from the Rainbow] tried steering us toward a smaller table more suited to a party of four, but relented because more of our friends were expected. We ended up with the shittiest waitress possible, and even though our booth filled up within minutes, a half hour passed and she had yet to take our order. So when Michael came to force our relocation, Axl refused to budge and told him, "We've been trying to order for twenty fucking minutes." Michael ignored him [...] I was halfway to the smaller table when I heard a commotion behind. I turned to see Axl pinning Michael backward over the table, fist cocked, ready to strike a devastating blow to Michael's left eye. [...] I was beyond pissed [after being thrown out of the Rainbow] and grumbling to myself as I rolled my chair out of the parking lot. When I took a right onto the sidewalk, there stood Axl with the body language of one contemplating handi-homicide. I peered angrily towards him and vented some steam of my own, hollering, "I can't believe you fucking got me kicked out!" Axl reached for a pair of sunglasses atop his head and fired them past my ear to smash against the wall. Then he yelled, "I can't believe you're mad at me after they disrespected us like that." [...] "I quit! Fuck you, and fuck L.A. Guns!"

[...] basically Axl quit on Halloween, like Halloween night we had a little thing at the Rainbow where he got in an argument with Michael, the Assistant Manager, and then I got kicked out too and I got mad at Axl, like, "He got me fucking kicked out man and there's all those whores in there right now." [...] And he's like, "I can't believe you're mad at me!" and he quit. And I was like bombed, I was like, "Fuck, dude." I mean, I'm a dick, you know, I'm sure I got in his face and shit some times, but most the time I kind of deferred, just like, "Okay, dude, whatever." You know, like, we'd argue, everybody argues, you know. Yeah, he quit over that but then he told me later, like after, you know, when he was getting ready to kick Tracii out of LA Guns later, you know, like the next year, that he quit because he didn't like Tracii, like, he was tired of Tracii [?]. Axl wanted to play in a band that was kind of like what Guns N' Roses became and Tracii's a metalhead so Tracii's like, when [?] told Axl wanted to do like a blues bass kind of hard rock Aerosmith-ish, you know, and the next thing you know he's playing like, you know, Sabbath and, you know, metal stuff, you know, like-

Yeah, Axl quit. I mean, you know, like, we got along great and, you know, we butt heads, you know, we were like young males with a little testosterone going so and we liked to drink, you know. Probably a lot of my friends if I wasn't in a wheelchair I would have gotten fist fights with the [?] you know.

Mike and Axl just didn't get along even back in the day. I don't know, it might have been something that predated- [...] I mean, they had like the same girlfriend at one point. Actually, Mike went out with her first and Axl like later or whatever. And then another thing is like everybody's like they [?] and everybody just liked Axl better. So for Mike you know, he left LA Guns, you know, or after he left LA Guns, and then Guns N' Roses started and they just got huge quick and it's like, you know, Mike, you know, because Axl was in LA Guns and they were drawing good then Mike came in the band they were drawing all right and then the draw got less and less and then Guns N' Roses starting to draw this fucking blew up, you know. [...] I just think Mike didn't have the drive that Axl had. Like, Mike was plenty talented enough, he was plenty good looking it up, and he was in the right place, but he just didn't, he just was waiting for world to come to him instead of, you know, going out there and taking it.

Michael always... man, he was bitter about Axl, right, he never liked Axl before I even saw Axl sing. But maybe it was just because like all the accolades. I mean when people saw Axl, they would comment and like, "Hey, that guy's pretty good," or whatever, you know, and I think Mike [?] "Well, I've been trained operatic, I can hit like," you know, "all these notes, I can sing like," you have, "Dio," you know, and he's just like Bon Scott and Mike didn't like AC/DC at all. So those kind of singers it's like, "That's not a singer."

Some of the songs on that LA Guns EP that Mike Jagosz sang on Axl had written lyrics and melodies for when he was in LA Guns.

About a week into 1985, I arrived to the studio to find Tracii and Mike [Jagosz] yelling and screaming at one another. A piss-drunk Mike had pawned Tracii's bookshelf speakers to buy more cocktails. [...] As Tracii stormed away, Mike yelled, "If you do that guns and roses thing, I am going to quit." Once everything calmed down, I asked, "What was that you said earlier, 'guns and roses'?" Mike sneered, "Tracii wants to do a jam band with Bill [=Axl] and call it "Guns and Roses."

I come into the studio over there at Gardner and Tracii had fired Mike and Mike was just piss drunk. And I guess Mike had pawned something that belonged to Tracii or something like that but it wasn't that big of a deal, it was something that was sitting around the studio and Mike had got just like 15 bucks so we could buy some more happy-hour drinks or whatever, I mean, basically the shit would have been out of pawn the next day. But so Tracii's like, "I calmed everybody down," I was like, "Come on, dude, we got to do this show at the Cats Club [?], you can't break up the band now we got a record out," blah-blah-blah. And so I got Tracii calmed down but then Mike was still being a dick and then Tracii just laughs and as Tracii's leaving, Mike goes, "Oh, and if you do that Guns And Roses thing I'm gonna fucking quit!" And then Mike went back inside the studio and said to JoJo, I go, "Hey, what's that 'Guns And Roses', man?" and he's like, "Oh, that's a jam band that Tracii and Axl were thinking of doing together," I'm like, "That's a great name."

So later [after October 1984] Tracii and me are living in the house together in North Hollywood, California, and LA Guns has a show that's booked, like even though there's no band, cuz he said "No Mike [Jagosz], no Mike." So Axl starts hanging around cuz Jojo, my brother, was friends with Axl, Tracii was friends with Axl, and Tracii wanted to start another band with this guy, Don Costa, who played with Ozzy for a minute, so Tracii's thinking he's gonna start a band with Tony Richards, the Wasp drummer, and Axl and Don Costa. So Ax was coming around and whatever, he's cool, we're getting along fine, there's no animosity with the LA Guns thing or whatever, we're just friends hanging out. And then, so Hollywood Rose played a one-off show in, I guess, February or March, probably March of 1985, and they got Robbie, the LA Guns drummer, to play the drums. Then after that show, like a couple days later, you know, everybody's hanging out and like, Tracii tells Axl, like, "Hey, we got this show at the Troubadour, LA Guns show, will you do the show?" And Axl immediately says, "Yes." Like, "Oh my god," I could not believe it. I was like, "Oh, that's cool."

So then Tracii made a flyer for LA Guns with Axl's little picture and everything [...]

By the following afternoon, Tracii had put together an L.A. Guns flyer with pictures of him, Axl, Robbie [Gardner; drums] and Ole [Beich; bass].

When Axl dropped by to approve the artwork, I said, "If you two are going to jam together, why not bring Izzy in and do that Guns and Roses thing you talked about?" Axl did a double take, gave me one of his dog-eat-dog sly smiles, and then, after a slight pause, nodded and said, "That sounds cool. I'll see if Izzy'll do it" [...] If it sounds like I, trying to claim credit for coming up with the name, I'm not. Axl Rose conjured up Guns N' Roses all by himself, combining surnames Tracii (Guns) and Axl (Rose). It's just until that very point in time, Axl had no idea I even knew he and Tracii had considered a side project. All I am laying claim to is this: Guns N' Roses formed in my living room after I suggested Izzy join in on a previously booked L.A. Guns show."

[...] when Axl said he'd do the LA Guns show, I said, "If you're gonna do that Troubadour show why don't you do that Guns N' Roses thing you're talking about? And bring Izzy in?" And then Axl's like, "I'll ask him."

That's Willie's place. Wilpower's [Studios] there. So there's the ones with the high angle shooting downward, that's from the loft and that's the stage they're standing, like there's a PA tower and they're standing next to that. And then, on the stairs, the stairs to the loft inside the studio. My brother JoJo took those pictures. So he was on the stage and taking a picture towards the stairs and then the other one was the exterior of the same building.

I'm well aware it's a common phenomenon for folks to believe their friends' mediocre band is great. But that very first rehearsal was totally awesome, dude. It was immediately evident Guns N' Roses were beyond something special. Without a doubt, L.A. Guns had delivered some major ass-kicking with Axl Rose up front, but the addition of Izzy and the new songs "Don't Cry," "Move to the City," and "Think About You" blew my mind.

I will remain a fan of Ole Beich till it's time for my dirt nap. [...] I still miss the guy and feel awful that he didn't seem to care enough at the time to make sure he stayed in Guns N' Roses. Unfortunately, at times the dude could be a real downer, sullen while keeping to himself [...] After that second practice, another rehearsal was set for a tentative "in a few days." Ole neglected to tell anyone of his newest girlfriend, so when the next practice got scheduled, there was no way to get ahold of him.

I sometimes wonder if it was a political play by Izzy, so Tracii would not have two automatic band-votes on his side to vote-block against him and Axl. But I think it far more likely Izzy felt Ole wasn't into it, and his style made G N' R too metal. I don't know the answer, but the next night, Izzy showed up to Wilpower Studios to introduce Duff Rose. That was his name the first time I met him, and we all knew it was a sign. Ole was an old-school, brain-damage, hard-rock 'n' roller, devoid of even the slightest punk influence. But Duff was an O.G. Seattle punk, pre-grunge glamster with a far more upbeat personality, a cool bro to hang out with, a world class musician, and no doubt perfect for Guns N' Roses. [...] Ole was surprised when I broke the news to him, but didn't argue or even ask me why until years later.

It's weird, maybe [Ole] thought his position like nothing was going to happen or he thought it was secure because, you know, everybody needed a bass player. And so he was kind of shocked when I told him that he wasn't in the band anymore.

So, okay, cuz Ole told me... like he didn't say anything that night when I told him that he was out of the band, I got a new bass player, like, he just was like, "Oh, whatever." And then when me and him went to see The Cult - Guns N' Roses opening for The Cult after Appetite for Destruction came out - and on the way home me and Oe drank like 20 Heineken, or whatever, I might not have been operating a motor vehicle, Ole told me he's like like bummed out on the way home, he's like, "Why am I not in that band? I should be getting my dick sucked in like 20 different languages right now." And then I was like, "Dude, you made your choice at the time, don't regret, on March 4," and he's like, "I didn't choose to not be in that band."

But then, so what happened, what [Ole] said when I told him he wasn't in GN'R anymore and he went to pick up his gear at the studio, Slash and Steven were over there jamming because Slash was in a band with the bass player Willie Basse who owned the studio where GN'R rehearsed, so Ole went to pick up his gear, Slash and Steven are there, so he starts jamming with them, so they're thinking they just going to get a singer and start a band, so Ole actually lost out twice. He's in GN'R and then he's forming a band with Slash and Steven and they end up going into GN'R. [...] it bummed him out, he was a sad man at the end of all that.

After three days of not hearing from [Ole], and rehearsal scheduled for the following evening, Izzy said, "If Ole doesn't want to be in the band, there's a guy who lives across the street from me who'll do the show."

I remember exactly what happened. There was a rehearsal and it was like, "Okay," you know, with Ole, and then the word was like, "In a couple of days we're gonna have another rehearsal." The next day Izzy says, "Hey, we got this radio interview set up, this radio interview, and we need to have a rehearsal tonight. So get everybody together." Ole had a new girlfriend, nobody could get ahold of him. So they weren't able to record. They were going to record with Ole, they just wanted to throw a rehearsal together and get Ole to do that tape for KPFK. Then Izzy said, you know, "If Ole doesn't want to be in this band then I know a guy," and then the next night he just brought Duff down and then they recorded that night during rehearsal, like 9-10 o'clock at night, and then went on the air and did the interview at like 2:00 in the morning or something like that at KPFK.

Izzy set it up. Izzy, when L.A. Guns and Guns N' Roses got together, Izzy was kind of like the big star of our town because he was in a band called London. It was kind of like a big draw and everything like. So L.A. Guns were like wannabes at the time. L.A. Guns had a draw but London was established. And Izzy was part of London and then people liked Izzy and then he just had the whole Melrose connection. So I think, like, if memory serves correct, that lady that was the DJ in that interview, she had some kind of ties to the Vinyl Fetish record store. Izzy knew her from down there or maybe they knew her and they said, "Hey Izzy, you could get your band on here."

[Duff] just did the rehearsal and then he went home and he had a nine to five or so. He went home and went to bed and went to work the next day.

Yeah, you know, you make flyers in a couple weeks out and then, you know, things change. And then the guy that plays the show isn't the guy on the flyer.

We all met up at the Troubadour around three in the afternoon for a first-ever Guns N' Roses' sound check, but the marquee said "L.A. Guns." A weeknight meant tables and chairs were set up in the showroom. Robbie and the crew had most of the gear set up by the time the rest of the band began straggling in, but I can't remember if I smoked pot with the crew.

One of the cool things about a band's debut show, whether they never play another gig or blow up hotter than Nagasaki, is that first crowd is loaded with friends there to support their friend(s). Before the show, Izzy, Axl, Duff, Tracii, and Robbie spent varying amounts of time in the showroom, having cocktails while chatting and personally thanking folks for coming. The guys were likely as excited to hit the stage, or possibly even more, than the crowd there was to discover what Guns N' Roses were all about. I for one was super excited, because I knew those folks were in for a treat. About an hour prior to their set, G N' R departed for the dressing room to read scripture while enjoying some tasty milk and cookies. Wait, that's Stryper. I have no idea what they did, because there were stairs between me and the Troub's dressing rooms.

Most weeknights local bands typically played to a few haggard chicks, their crew, and tables. But the show had a decent-sized crowd, not huge, but slightly larger than the L.A. Guns' gig a few months earlier. A hundred fifty fans, give or take. There were several folks who I recognized as L.A. Guns regulars, a bunch of teeny boppers whose two drink tickets were mostly used for soft drinks. But there were also scores of older folks, more punk-looking and often lined up three deep at the showroom bar. Then when their beloved liquor got served, they stuffed tip jars in hopes Ms. Barkeep would keep hooking them up.

Then it all began. The showroom light dimmed. An array of colored lights cut through a nicotine haze to paint the stage in hot hues. From stage left, the guys descended the stairway onto the stage. Robbie got busy fine-tuning his drums' positions as Izzy, Duff, and Tracii plugged in, tuned up, switched their amps off of standby, twisted some knobs, and then gestured to one another. Good to go.

The house music faded away as the voice of God announced the band from on high. Izzy stuck his smoke near the head of his ax and motioned to count it out. Without a hint of hesitation, Robbie raised drum sticks high above his head and "Click-click-click-click." One, two, three, four, the band threw a sonic punch into the crowds' face as Axl, decked out in chaps and g-string, bounded down the stairs to burst onto that stage as if shot from a howitzer. Having only been unleashed before a crowd once in the previous five months, Axl set his pent-up dervish free with a spontaneous and fresh kinetic overload that saw him trying his damndest to stomp a hole through the Troubadour's stage straight to China.

The guys' image was more glam than later images, like the 70s glam of Aerosmith, T-Rex, Sweet, or Bowie. And not like their contemporary scene's spandex-clad trannys playing loosely inspired Val Halen or Crüe. Axl didn't offer much commentary between tunes. The band merely delivered a few blistering songs in a row, then, after a short pause to allow folks to wipe the blood from their ears, he'd let the audience know what was next. When G N' R were ready to play "Nice Boys," he dedicated it to Poison with the same mocking disdain as during L.A. Guns gigs. Although Poison was pulling huge crowds into the clubs, Axl routinely made it crystal clear he didn't like Poison or consider what they played rock 'n' roll.

Over the next five years, I saw G N' R perform or rehearse at least a hundred times, and probably far more than that. Combine all those gigs with my love for booze, pot, and various other mind-altering cash killers, and I would be guessing about what else was on that night's set list. It's safe to say, "Jumpin' Jack Flash," Heartbreak Hotel," "Shadow of Your Love," and for sure "Think About You," "Move to the City," "Don't Cry" and "Anything Goes."

The last time I had seen Izzy and Axl together on stage was in Rose, a super frenetic band that constantly hopped and bopped while bouncing off of one another. Axl was still the incredibly dynamic bundle of energy, drawing lots of attention up front, but Izzy settled into a far more laid-back groove, absorbed in song while seemingly as one with the timbre, rhythm, and melody. It was my first time watching Duff on stage, but I really dug his bass tone, smooth chops, and in-your-face energy. Tracii was Tracii, a very entertaining showman and talented shredder with a great guitar sound. Robbie remained solid and right on time, neither boring nor flashy [Raz Cue, "The Days of Guns, & Raz's", 2015, p. 200-202].

I didn't book Dancing Waters. That was a Rose connection that got them in there. But the Radio City, and then with the Timbers Ballroom and the Troubadour. Yeah, I booked all those shows, like the first couple of times they played there.

It's just, you know, we just liked to play, the guys liked to play wherever, you know, and, like, go party and play and you would get paid. You can't just... the Troubadour will book you like every month and a half month and a week or whatever, it's not enough shows, you know. So you do an Orange County, you know, you do like, and even Glendora, Fenders Ballroom that's kind of [?]. That's a bump up, Glendora, you know. You know, you just kind of did the little circuit, you know. That was LA Guns' style. But Guns N' Roses, man, they started playing like they all had connections. They started playing like, I think four or five shows, six shows a month, and then. man, they just started hitting it like playing two or three a week if they could get a gig.

I hadn't seen that flyer until like last year. I saw it and I kind of remember like a semblance of a story. But I don't know. Yeah man, I don't want to say because it's kind of cheesy if what happened is what I think happened. But I don't know, man. I don't know for sure. I don't want to, like, name any names or any things. So I kind of that flyer jogged my memory and I was like, "Oh!" But yeah, I can't. I can't. Sometimes people have issues, you know, with each other. I mean, obviously, I guess Robbie had issues because he wasn't in the band later, right, so maybe there was a precursor that might have led to why maybe Robbie decided later, like at the point where they wanted him to stay, "Okay, well you guys put a fucking flyer out with a question mark over the drummer," and like, "How loyal are you?"

[...] that's a girl, Chris Amouroux. [...] She was like one of those people, like, she was really helpful and she would take photos and help people make flyers and everything like that, sewed some clothes for people, like this designer type person who is creative, helpful music lover. She did a lot of LA Guns stuff later when they reformed with Paul Black stuff. There's a lot of photos that she did with that them so I'm assuming maybe she was a Tracii person or whatever, and then once Tracy was gone, she didn't do any more GN'R stuff. I don't know. But she was around so everybody knew her. She's one of those.

You know, most of that stuff, you know, like with that Roots of Guns N' Roses record. And then... Was Move To The City on that record? I don't think... So Move To The City added to that and then Don't Cry. Back Off Bitch is on the Roots one.

Izzy, Axl, and Duff each had their own business instincts, ideas, and connections. But no one ever cared what a drummer has to say. And Tracii was still in baby-rock-star mode, more than content to have others worry about band stuff.

Yeah, I think like Tracii, okay, I say Tracii got fired but he says different but whatever. So then like a couple days later, like, they said, "Hey," they just assumed you were gonna still be in the band or whatever, you know, and then I think you thought you were out, you and Tracii was gone, I was like there was a miscommunication, so like two days later you're like, "Wait, we're done, man."

I hadn't seen that flyer until like last year. I saw it and I kind of remember like a semblance of a story. But I don't know. Yeah man, I don't want to say because it's kind of cheesy if what happened is what I think happened. But I don't know, man. I don't know for sure. I don't want to, like, name any names or any things. So I kind of that flyer jogged my memory and I was like, "Oh!" But yeah, I can't. I can't. Sometimes people have issues, you know, with each other. I mean, obviously, I guess Robbie had issues because he wasn't in the band later, right, so maybe there was a precursor that might have led to why maybe Robbie decided later, like at the point where they wanted him to stay, "Okay, well you guys put a fucking flyer out with a question mark over the drummer," and like, "How loyal are you?"

A day after Tracii got ousted, Robbie quit the band. We were all floored. No one had even contemplated Robbie abandoning the project. Izzy and Axl tried to change his mind. When that didn't bear fruit, they asked me to have a talk with Robbie and let him know they really wanted him in the band. At the very least, see if he'd stay until they found another drummer. When I called Robbie to see where his head was at and tell him he was missing a great opportunity, before I even got my whole pitch delivered, he gave me a dismissive "I'm not going to play with those guys." [...]

The guys were pissed at Robbie for leaving them hanging, so Izzy taught me an awesome trick, which I employed relentlessly over the next decade - a free ad got placed in the Recycler, something like: "Gay Drummer Available. Into Duran Duran, Flock of Seagulls, Pet Shop Boys, Haircut One Hundred...Call Robbie before 6 a.m.," and listed Robbie's number. Classic!

But they thought that Robbie was gonna stay on drums. But then as soon as Slash came in, like they wanted Robbie to be on drums, they were leaving in like two days to go to Seattle. And so Robbie's like, "I'm not going up there." So Steven knew the songs and they just took him up there and then when they came back there was no talk about, like, trying to get Robbie back in the bank. They always kind of wanted Robbie to like stay even when Steven was like willing to do it, they wanted Robbie. But Robbie would, you know, with Tracii, they were a team.

It wasn't an automatic deal that Steven Adler joined Guns N' Roses, merely an audition. When done, he packed his gear and split. After he hit the road, Joe [Raz' brother] set up Steven's kit again so the guys could audition a few other drummers. There was a dude, Chain, who Axl really dug and insisted on hiring. Izzy steadfastly refused to play with him, and almost quit G N' R over it. At some point, Chain told me, "I don't think Izzy liked me." I said, "It's worse than that." To keep everyone calm, some diplomatic maneuvers were employed. All agreed Steven would play the next show, but G N' R would keep searching for a drummer.

Yeah, I think like Tracii, okay, I say Tracii got fired but he says different but whatever. So then like a couple days later, like, they said, "Hey," they just assumed you were gonna still be in the band or whatever, you know, and then I think you thought you were out, you and Tracii was gone, I was like there was a miscommunication, so like two days later you're like, "Wait, we're done, man."

Initially, only three of Tracii's tunes even made it into rehearsal, and at shows he was lucky if the guys even played one of them. Five shows in, and it was all Izzy and Axl's songs, plus some covers. Instead of taking it as a challenge, Tracii acted perpetually petulant. The morning after G N' R played the Timbers gig [April 27], Axl was in an extremely foul mood. More specifically, he was thoroughly pissed off at Tracii, who the night before reportedly remained out of sight behind his Marshall stacks the entire show, all the while playing way too loud and purposely fucking up songs.

Axl went on and on griping, and I began to get the impression he sought my okay to get rid of Tracii, so I said, "Fuck Tracii. Fire him if you want. [...]

Izzy and Axl agreed Tracii would get the boot from Guns N' Roses after their next show, the second week of May, giving them a month to find a replacement.[...]

The next afternoon, Tracii called me to tell me about Axl firing him from G N' R. Tracii didn't seem at all upset, mostly just talked shit about the guys.

[Axl] just thought Tracii was... Like, Tracii was like, at the Timbers Ballroom show, Tracii was just, he said Tracii was just standing behind his Marshall amps the whole time and playing like way louder than everybody else, he wouldn't even like come out to the front of the stage and everything like that. And then he's like, he's gonna fire him, then he's like he waited till after that Joshua Parlor's show and then Slash is going to be in the band.

Axl only had one guitarist in mind. But Izzy expressed a desire to explore all options, in hopes of finding an older, more established musician. Axl remained steadfast and eventually convinced Izzy to at least invite Slash over to talk music, and perhaps those two might play some guitar together. The day after that get-together, Axl happily reported of his plan's rousing success. Izzy was floored by Slash's talent, and a quick meeting turned into those two jamming through the practice amps in Izzy's living room for most of the day.

Steven had even that double bass for like the first two months or whatever when he joined but then, you know, it just went begin went to a single kick after that and that changed the sound like night to day.

You know, as a child I wanted to be like the biggest rock star in the world. But I had guess I just had to meet one instead.

And then eventually, you know, I had some money from a settlement, I broke my neck, and then when I was 15, I got some settlement money. I decided I was gonna be like a music mogul. Like, threw money around everywhere.

I had seen Axl like with Hollywood Rose, actually just Rose, him and Izzy. And I always thought that guy was great, like right from the get go. And I always thought, like, if him and Tracii would jam together, that'd be awesome. He knew Tracii already, and Tracii and Izzy were pretty tight.

[...] but in reality, all I did was let them use my place for band meetings. Or, if they were short, I'd chip in a few bucks - like five - for rehearsal. I'd share my reheated leftover Naugles' French fries, or let them borrow my van, amps, cabinets, wireless microphone, or whatever they needed. Joe, Guns N' Roses' stage manager, would cart all the gear to the show, and when my van came home, so did my gear. No charge. With a vast fecal sea of inferior bands drowning Hollywood, it was my pleasure to help out an obviously above-average group. Didn't cost me nothing, and that gear would just have sat in storage with my van stuck in the driveway. Plus, I got to see G N' R well over a hundred times and you didn't.

I mean, I think technically I was [their manager]. I mean, they referred to me as their manager for, you know, at least a couple of months. And I kind of had this notion that, like, I had just come out of the LA Guns thing and I had learned like, I kind of learned like business training, like, on the fly. And I realized that bands didn't really need managers until they had something to manage. And you know, you just need some shows. And so, yeah, they didn't really need a manager and so once- [...] I was LA Guns' manager that became Guns and Roses and then soon I was no longer the manager because they didn't need a manager and I didn't want to put the time into it or the love or the effort.

I mean, Steven and me would hang out. He crashed over there all the time. Tracii Guns like had a room, rented a room for a couple of months at the house when Guns N' Roses formed. And then Axl would stay over there quite often. And then once Tracii moved out, my brother JoJo, the road manager for Guns N' Roses, rented Tracii's room. And then Axl started staying there all the time. But he didn't officially live there, but he was there all the time, you know.

He's cool, like he kept to himself, there was like a little covered patio on the back, he stood out there and listened to records or write or whatever. [...] he was cool, man. We would like, you know, rock out and smoke a little pot or whatever.

I got in a little argument with my brother, he was staying in my house and Axl were staying over there, too, and I got in an argument with my brother and then I threw in some shit talking to Axl at the same time and they both stormed out. I didn't see GN'R for like three months after that, I just like boycotted them. I was like, "I want those people..." like, I hold a grudge with both hands so I didn't go see the band and nothing.

That house was cool because there wasn't enough space for everybody to go if they needed just to get away from each other. So it was more of a financial thing like, I'm like, you know... Like, my brother was like, "Okay, dude, I rented you the room, but you can't have this guy over here all the time," you know? It's like, "He's cool and everything but give me some money." [...] You know, it's funny because I had a little issue with my brother and him and Axl were tight. My brother was the stage manager. I had been with L.A. Guns and we had everything to a point where it was ready to break, or at least break whatever level we were gonna, you know, do. We had the record out, everything. And then it all fell apart because nobody really cared about, like, taking it....whatever. Nobody cared about the time or effort that I put into it at that... So I just saw the same thing happen. I'm like, "Man, if I work with this band, they could just decide like three or four months from now they're all going to break up and I would have put all my time and effort into it." And I just figured they were gonna break up again and I didn't want to be dealing with it. And then I remember Slash called me, like I didn't go to the show, like after I got in a fight with my brother, like, I didn't go because me and my brother weren't talking. So Slash called me up, like, "What happened?" you know, and I was like, "Yeah, I kind of got mad at,", you know, "JoJo and Axl yesterday and then booted them out of my house and all this stuff, but I'm cool, you know, so I'm cool with the band." And he's like, "Hey, you should manage us, man." Still, I'm like, "No, dude, if you guys stay together for a year, I'll manage you." So yeah, they were already signed by the time the year came by. I offered them again like a year later, I was like, "Yeah, I'll manage you guys now" [laughs].

My biggest issue was the house only had one bathroom and there was four dudes living there. I just wanted the fucking bathroom. Like, if you're gonna, like, block me out of the bathroom for like an hour, pay some rent, or whatever. But I didn't really have a big issue with him with rent. Basically I was kind of just irritated at my brother for putting me in the situation to having to choose like be a dick to Axl because, you know, am I part little bit of star [?], I knew the guy was talented, I knew he was gonna be some sort of success, and I didn't want him to hate me because I was like trying to get, you know, $100 out of him to stay in my house, or whatever. I thought it was kind of a dicky move from my brother to put me in that spot. But then when I blew up at my brother, like there was some gear that went missing. Like my gear, like expensive shit and it was missing for like days and my brother was kind of blocking like, you know, he was like, "Oh, it's over at Izzy's house, I'll get it." And then I put my foot down like, "If I don't get my fucking gear right now," right? So then they're like, "Oh, it's been missing." Turns out there was a roadie named Carlos and he fucking stole the shit and sold it. But I didn't know that at the time and I would have liked to have found out right away that my [?] of $1000 worth of gear is missing. So I just blew up at my brother and, "Get the fuck out of my house," and that was it, man, we didn't talk for like three or four months. He was with Guns N' Roses, like, he was their stage manager and it was like, "Okay, man, I'm not going to go to their shows, either." So that was just it, you know. But this was all bullshit and we started talking again. You know, brothers.

I went on the road with them and the couple of shows out in the New York and, like, whenever they played here, like, I would just, you know, like, I'd drive Axl around after the show. So like, everything was good, man, I don't know what happened. [...] You know, the Paradise City video they shot that at Giants Stadium, that show with the Aerosmith and Deep Purple, right? That was the last time, yeah, I hung out with them and then they went to Boston the next day and then... Oh, they went to Donington and did the rest of that Paradise City video. And then, yeah, I never really talked to... I mean, I've run into Axl a couple times after that, but he never called me after that. Or like that's when I went home from the New York stuff. I don't know, maybe I did something to piss people off. I kind of got a mouth on me. So I don't know, maybe I said the wrong thing to the wrong person.

After the Giants stadium, so I still went to shows and everything was good, and so, you know, like I went to the, they played at the Cathouse and then I got in there. I didn't have a problem getting tickets or anything like that. And then they played at the RIP Anniversary Party, I with to that. And then they played with the Rolling Stones, like four or five shows. I think four. I went to like three of those. But the Stones were the last one I went to. The last time that I actually saw Izzy is funny, me and Mike Jagosz we're going to the Troubadour and I used to take [?] little backstreet for parking place for free and there was Izzy was walking across the street. So I like honked at him and I was like, "Guns N' Roses sucks!" And he like just stuck his middle finger up in the air from behind, like if he had his back pain, and he kept walking and he took like three steps and he's like, "Raz!" And he turns around and yes, we hung out all that night, man, he took me to clubs and they were buying him drinks because be was Izzy from Guns N' Roses. [?] We just hung out like pretty much all night that night.

I actually saw Slash at the Rainbow like in the early 2000s. He was across the room and then like four or five tables down. If I was there... Man, I'm trying to think I was with J.J. Bolt and he was a guitar player for The Wild. So we were just hanging out and then have pizza - because the Rainbow Bar and Grill has the best pizza ever. But, with that being said, so yeah, Slash's over there and everybody was kind of mobbing him and he was like kind of like hidden move[?] through the crowd and I was like, "Man," I didn't want to say nothing, I was like, "Man," I hadn't seen the guy forever and whatever. And then he, like, he just looked and said, "Raz!" and he just came over and chatted at our table, man, we hung out, Him and J.J. were buddies, obviously, because, you know, fellow guitar players and, you know, they bands liked each other. Hung out for like 20 minutes or 30 minutes. Buyed me a cup of drinks.